scooter gas

[b***@m.nu]

I have read that ethanol free gas is better for a scooter I have also
read that higher octane gas is better, which of those two are most
important? ethanol free is 89 octane....

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
I have read that ethanol free gas is better for a scooter I have also
read that higher octane gas is better, which of those two are most
important? ethanol free is 89 octane....

Better to check the owners manual or look for a sticker specifying the
required grade.

Typically, high octane is required because it is harder to burn --
hence does not "knock" or "ping" in hot high compression engines. Ethanol
content, OTOH, attracts water, which may cause corrosion in parts of the
fuel system. Also depends upon just how much alcohol is in the mix. Are we
talking E85 (85% alcohol, 15% gasoline) which pretty much requires an
engine designed for alcohol and should not be used in non "flex fuel"
engines. OR E10 (10% alcohol)?

Due to the water attraction and solvent capability, using E10 or
similar may require one to change oil more often, and to add gas-dry if the
bike is used with low mileage (that is, one is not refilling the tank on a
weekly basis, say)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_ethanol_fuel_mixtures (in particular
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_ethanol_fuel_mixtures#Use_limitations
though the article mostly focuses on automobile engines)

[b***@m.nu]

On Sat, 01 Dec 2018 14:33:14 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I have read that ethanol free gas is better for a scooter I have also
read that higher octane gas is better, which of those two are most
important? ethanol free is 89 octane....

Better to check the owners manual or look for a sticker specifying the
required grade.
Typically, high octane is required because it is harder to burn --
hence does not "knock" or "ping" in hot high compression engines. Ethanol
content, OTOH, attracts water, which may cause corrosion in parts of the
fuel system. Also depends upon just how much alcohol is in the mix. Are we
talking E85 (85% alcohol, 15% gasoline) which pretty much requires an
engine designed for alcohol and should not be used in non "flex fuel"
engines. OR E10 (10% alcohol)?
Due to the water attraction and solvent capability, using E10 or
similar may require one to change oil more often, and to add gas-dry if the
bike is used with low mileage (that is, one is not refilling the tank on a
weekly basis, say)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_ethanol_fuel_mixtures (in particular
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_ethanol_fuel_mixtures#Use_limitations
though the article mostly focuses on automobile engines)

just the regular ethanol grade gas that is like at the gas station I
think just 10 %. I was using the low grade gas and it seemed to run
like crap especially when it is cold.... Even sometimes when it is
warm I will not get up to top speed which is about 33 mph. I was
thinking that was the low grade gas but I have switched to the 93
octane. have not noticed a difference yet but it is still a mixed
tank. Should I switch to the 89 octane ethanol or stay at the 93
octane

I have a tao tao jet 50

I can not find the gas requirement anywhere on the bike or in the
owners manual. I will ride with my current gas which is 93 octane then
switch to ethanol free gas at a lower octane. I read just now that the
ethanol can really mess up a scooter engine.

Also I want to ask you if you have any knowledge with up grading my
engine with a 80 CC or 100 or even 150 cc kit. is it worth it? Will it
ruin my engine? Any knowledge you have will help.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
I can not find the gas requirement anywhere on the bike or in the
owners manual. I will ride with my current gas which is 93 octane then
switch to ethanol free gas at a lower octane. I read just now that the
ethanol can really mess up a scooter engine.

Can't help... I've had two bikes: Vespa GT200 and currently a decade
old Aprilia Scarabeo 500 ABS. Both were spec'd for premium fuel (and the
highest octane I routinely find is still a point or two lower than the
manual recommends).

Can't find a manual on the TaoTao US web-site (BTW: if you are getting
real 33mph, you are doing well -- the web-site states only 25mph, and 33mph
exceeds many states' limit for unlicensed moped class... OTOH many
speedometers have a near 10% error on them, so your real speed may be
closer to 29mph)

Post by b***@m.nu
Also I want to ask you if you have any knowledge with up grading my
engine with a 80 CC or 100 or even 150 cc kit. is it worth it? Will it
ruin my engine? Any knowledge you have will help.

Again, no help. And -- in the US, anything larger than 49cc (often sold
as 50cc, but the real size is just under that) would require full
registration and licensing. In California, anything under 150cc is a
"motor-driven cycle" ("moped" class MUST have bicycle PEDALS and a top
assisted speed of around 20-25 mph -- so mostly these are electric bicycles
with 750kW drives) and requires a full M1 motorcycle drivers license (the
"moped" requires an M2 license. Motor-driven cycle is not allowed on
freeways -- >150cc is a "motorcycle" and freeway legal. Michigan does have
an unlicenced moped class for <50cc, but does require a registration (no
license plate, but an ugly decal on the rear fender reading "moped"),
50-125cc is a non-freeway motorcycle, >125cc is freeway legal (that law
must go back to when federal freeway speed limit was 55mph -- I'd be
concerned taking the Vespa GT200 on a current freeway with 70mph limits; it
was full out to keep in traffic in 65mph).

[b***@m.nu]

On Sat, 01 Dec 2018 19:01:57 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I can not find the gas requirement anywhere on the bike or in the
owners manual. I will ride with my current gas which is 93 octane then
switch to ethanol free gas at a lower octane. I read just now that the
ethanol can really mess up a scooter engine.

Can't help... I've had two bikes: Vespa GT200 and currently a decade
old Aprilia Scarabeo 500 ABS. Both were spec'd for premium fuel (and the
highest octane I routinely find is still a point or two lower than the
manual recommends).
Can't find a manual on the TaoTao US web-site (BTW: if you are getting
real 33mph, you are doing well -- the web-site states only 25mph, and 33mph
exceeds many states' limit for unlicensed moped class... OTOH many
speedometers have a near 10% error on them, so your real speed may be
closer to 29mph)

after a few days when my gauges read 40 + mph I know it was way off...
so I used a cell gps to get my actual speed... My max speed clocked in
at 33 mph. But the thing about that is before I switched to 93 octant
I reached that speed maybe 10 % of the time after 93 octane I have
reached that speed about 15 % of the time when my tank was half full I
put another half gallon of 89 octane Ethanol free and I reached a
speed of 45 ok my gauge but not sure actual speed and I got to that
speed like 90% of the time. So ethanol free was the key to all of the
problems I have been experiencing... So now I guess I will need to run
some carb cleaner in my tank to clean any ethanol gunk that has built
up.... even though I have only been running e10 gas for about a 2-3
weeks so it really should not be all that bad.

Today after I added half a tank of ethanol free (I guess it would be
around an E5 rating from the E0 I added today and the e10 that was
already in my tank) my speedometer actually pegged out at 50 MPH a
couple of times. Now I don't know what my actual speed was but from
what I can tell with the errors my actual speed must have be around 40
+ or - 3 mph

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
Also I want to ask you if you have any knowledge with up grading my
engine with a 80 CC or 100 or even 150 cc kit. is it worth it? Will it
ruin my engine? Any knowledge you have will help.

Again, no help. And -- in the US, anything larger than 49cc (often sold
as 50cc, but the real size is just under that) would require full
registration and licensing. In California, anything under 150cc is a
"motor-driven cycle" ("moped" class MUST have bicycle PEDALS and a top
assisted speed of around 20-25 mph -- so mostly these are electric bicycles
with 750kW drives) and requires a full M1 motorcycle drivers license (the
"moped" requires an M2 license. Motor-driven cycle is not allowed on
freeways -- >150cc is a "motorcycle" and freeway legal. Michigan does have
an unlicenced moped class for <50cc, but does require a registration (no
license plate, but an ugly decal on the rear fender reading "moped"),
50-125cc is a non-freeway motorcycle, >125cc is freeway legal (that law
must go back to when federal freeway speed limit was 55mph -- I'd be
concerned taking the Vespa GT200 on a current freeway with 70mph limits; it
was full out to keep in traffic in 65mph).

I am in Louisiana and I am fairly sure the moped/scooter laws say that
anything above 5 HP requires a motorcycle endorsement on you drivers
licence. My 50 cc is less than 2 Hp so a 100 should be less than 5 HP
right?

I just want to be able to keep up with traffic a little better... Some
of those vehicles pass me without completely going to the other lane,
and that is just scary...

I figure with a 100 CC I should be able to hit speeds closer to 50-55

I would be more nervous taking a scooter on the freeway because the
tires are so small and with speeds at like 50-60 mph it just seems
hitting a pothole at that speed would be damn near suicidal.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
I am in Louisiana and I am fairly sure the moped/scooter laws say that
anything above 5 HP requires a motorcycle endorsement on you drivers
licence. My 50 cc is less than 2 Hp so a 100 should be less than 5 HP
right?

No... According to https://www.dmv.org/la-louisiana/other-types.php a
"moped" must have capable of being pedaled, be less than 50cc AND less than
1.5 HP with a top speed of 25MPH AND requires a motorcycle license.

http://www.motorizedbicyclehq.com/motorized-bicycle-laws-louisiana/
puts electric bicycles at 750W and 20MPH top speed; gas "moped" must have
pedals. Wonder what that site defines as a "scooter" as it indicates
scooters are not legal.

http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/law.aspx?d=88385 does exclude the need for
motorcycle license on <5HP

http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/law.aspx?d=88370 defines the 5HP limit as a
motor-driven cycle vs motorized bicycle...

However, I wouldn't be so sure a 100cc would still be under 5HP. My
former 200cc Vespa had around 20 HP (a linear extrapolation would make a
100cc 10HP). The 460cc Dung Beetle is about 40HP (it's a bit less efficient
as it is a single cylinder engine, and moving that large a piston through
the non-power strokes eats into power -- most 500cc class engines are twin
cylinder designs).

A 150cc Vespa is just over 11 HP, the LX125 is 10HP. Just using those as
example,

[b***@m.nu]

On Mon, 03 Dec 2018 16:55:12 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I am in Louisiana and I am fairly sure the moped/scooter laws say that
anything above 5 HP requires a motorcycle endorsement on you drivers
licence. My 50 cc is less than 2 Hp so a 100 should be less than 5 HP
right?

No... According to https://www.dmv.org/la-louisiana/other-types.php a
"moped" must have capable of being pedaled, be less than 50cc AND less than
1.5 HP with a top speed of 25MPH AND requires a motorcycle license.
http://www.motorizedbicyclehq.com/motorized-bicycle-laws-louisiana/
puts electric bicycles at 750W and 20MPH top speed; gas "moped" must have
pedals. Wonder what that site defines as a "scooter" as it indicates
scooters are not legal.
http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/law.aspx?d=88385 does exclude the need for
motorcycle license on <5HP
http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/law.aspx?d=88370 defines the 5HP limit as a
motor-driven cycle vs motorized bicycle...
However, I wouldn't be so sure a 100cc would still be under 5HP. My
former 200cc Vespa had around 20 HP (a linear extrapolation would make a
100cc 10HP). The 460cc Dung Beetle is about 40HP (it's a bit less efficient
as it is a single cylinder engine, and moving that large a piston through
the non-power strokes eats into power -- most 500cc class engines are twin
cylinder designs).
A 150cc Vespa is just over 11 HP, the LX125 is 10HP. Just using those as
example,

When I was trying to look up the laws to know what I needed to
register and drive I must have spend days and days looking that crap
up because I kept seeing different answers to my question.

The thing about the pedals, it says motor OR human powered, meaning
either or. I don't think it actually matters about pedals.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
The thing about the pedals, it says motor OR human powered, meaning
either or. I don't think it actually matters about pedals.

"""
(19) "Motorized bicycle" means a pedal bicycle which may be propelled by
human power or helper motor, or by both, with a motor rated no more than
one and one-half horsepower, a cylinder capacity not exceeding fifty cubic
centimeters, an automatic transmission, and which produces a maximum design
speed of no more than twenty-five miles per hour on a flat surface.
"""

"pedal bicycle" -- the rest just means the motor doesn't /have/ to be
running when using the "motorized bicycle". This is the derivation of
"moped" (motor-pedal).


"""
(18) "Motor-driven cycle" means every motorcycle, including every motor
scooter, with a motor of not to exceed five horsepower.
"""

This category does not include mopeds -- it is a low-powered subclass of
motorcycle, and ...

"""
(17) "Motorcycle" means every motor vehicle having a seat or saddle for the
use of the rider and designed to travel on not more than three wheels in
contact with the ground, but excluding a tractor and a motorized bicycle.
"""

... explicitly EXCLUDES motorized bicycle from the "motorcycle" category.

So... if it is >1.5HP, regardless of having pedals, it is NOT a
"motorized bicycle". If it is <5HP and not a "motorized bicycle" it is a
"motor-driven cycle". If it is >5HP it is a full "motorcycle"


Granted -- they also add in

"""
(21) "Power cycle" means every motor vehicle propelled by an engine
developing not more than five brake horse power, designed to travel on not
more than three wheels, at a speed under thirty-five miles per hour, and
equipped with brakes adequate to stop such vehicle upon a reasonably clean,
dry, level surface within forty-five feet from the spot where the brakes
were first applied when the vehicle is travelling at twenty miles per hour.
"""

which would include "motor-driven cycle" with the caveat of a top speed of
35MPH, but would also cover a low-powered three-wheel "car" (enclosed cabin
and side-by-side seating -- a la the Ape
http://www.piaggiocommercialvehicles.com/en_EN/models/ape/ape-50/ [not
named for monkeys... Piaggio produced the 2-wheel Vespa "Wasp" and for work
created the Ape "Bee"])

[b***@m.nu]

On Wed, 05 Dec 2018 15:40:58 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
The thing about the pedals, it says motor OR human powered, meaning
either or. I don't think it actually matters about pedals.

"""
(19) "Motorized bicycle" means a pedal bicycle which may be propelled by
human power or helper motor, or by both, with a motor rated no more than
one and one-half horsepower, a cylinder capacity not exceeding fifty cubic
centimeters, an automatic transmission, and which produces a maximum design
speed of no more than twenty-five miles per hour on a flat surface.
"""
"pedal bicycle" -- the rest just means the motor doesn't /have/ to be
running when using the "motorized bicycle". This is the derivation of
"moped" (motor-pedal).
"""
(18) "Motor-driven cycle" means every motorcycle, including every motor
scooter, with a motor of not to exceed five horsepower.
"""
This category does not include mopeds -- it is a low-powered subclass of
motorcycle, and ...
"""
(17) "Motorcycle" means every motor vehicle having a seat or saddle for the
use of the rider and designed to travel on not more than three wheels in
contact with the ground, but excluding a tractor and a motorized bicycle.
"""
... explicitly EXCLUDES motorized bicycle from the "motorcycle" category.
So... if it is >1.5HP, regardless of having pedals, it is NOT a
"motorized bicycle". If it is <5HP and not a "motorized bicycle" it is a
"motor-driven cycle". If it is >5HP it is a full "motorcycle"

ahh that clears it up, I think I was just getting motorized cycle and
motorized bicycle mixed up

If I had my choice I would get an 80cc 2 stroke scooter....

I had an 80 cc 2 stroke dirt bike when I was a kid... that thing got
up to 50-60 mph

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber
Granted -- they also add in
"""
(21) "Power cycle" means every motor vehicle propelled by an engine
developing not more than five brake horse power, designed to travel on not
more than three wheels, at a speed under thirty-five miles per hour, and
equipped with brakes adequate to stop such vehicle upon a reasonably clean,
dry, level surface within forty-five feet from the spot where the brakes
were first applied when the vehicle is travelling at twenty miles per hour.
"""
which would include "motor-driven cycle" with the caveat of a top speed of
35MPH, but would also cover a low-powered three-wheel "car" (enclosed cabin
and side-by-side seating -- a la the Ape
http://www.piaggiocommercialvehicles.com/en_EN/models/ape/ape-50/ [not
named for monkeys... Piaggio produced the 2-wheel Vespa "Wasp" and for work
created the Ape "Bee"])

[b***@m.nu]

On Wed, 05 Dec 2018 15:40:58 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber
<***@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
Dude where did you go?

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
On Wed, 05 Dec 2018 15:40:58 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber
Dude where did you go?

I had nothing else to add...

[b***@m.nu]

On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 13:28:40 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
On Wed, 05 Dec 2018 15:40:58 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber
Dude where did you go?

I had nothing else to add...

oh ok sorry I thought you went on vacation or something LOL

I was having problems with my scooter and I was hoping that maybe you
could help...


It just will not start. It turns over Gas is flowing and there is a
spark... just wont start

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
It just will not start. It turns over Gas is flowing and there is a
spark... just wont start

Other than possible flooding, no real suggestion. Do you smell fuel
vapors from the exhaust pipe? Try holding the throttle open for five
minutes (nothing else) to let air/evaporation from the intake channels. Try
holding the throttle partly open when starting.

[b***@m.nu]

On Fri, 21 Dec 2018 11:55:25 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
It just will not start. It turns over Gas is flowing and there is a
spark... just wont start

Other than possible flooding, no real suggestion. Do you smell fuel
vapors from the exhaust pipe? Try holding the throttle open for five
minutes (nothing else) to let air/evaporation from the intake channels. Try
holding the throttle partly open when starting.

What I ended up doing is opening the manifold and spraying starter
fluid in just to see if I could get it to crank, and I did. So that
would mean that either the carb is just clogged or bad or I got a bad
tank of gas.... Since I have been using the same gas from the same gas
station it has to be the carb.

I have sent my results to the place where I bought the bike from and
they said they will send me a new carb.

[b***@m.nu]

On Fri, 21 Dec 2018 11:55:25 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
It just will not start. It turns over Gas is flowing and there is a
spark... just wont start

Other than possible flooding, no real suggestion. Do you smell fuel
vapors from the exhaust pipe? Try holding the throttle open for five
minutes (nothing else) to let air/evaporation from the intake channels. Try
holding the throttle partly open when starting.

I think I just had a bad tank of gas, I drained it put more in and it
ran, it ran like shit but it still ran. It would die on me at almost
every red light and stop sign.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
I think I just had a bad tank of gas, I drained it put more in and it
ran, it ran like shit but it still ran. It would die on me at almost
every red light and stop sign.

Possibly clogged idle jets... or an idle speed set too low (my first
bike -- Vespa GT200 -- had a tendency for the idle speed screw to drift
from vibration).

[b***@m.nu]

On Sun, 23 Dec 2018 12:13:16 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I think I just had a bad tank of gas, I drained it put more in and it
ran, it ran like shit but it still ran. It would die on me at almost
every red light and stop sign.

Possibly clogged idle jets... or an idle speed set too low (my first
bike -- Vespa GT200 -- had a tendency for the idle speed screw to drift
from vibration).

From all the damn videos I think that the carburetor is running to
rich or is it to lean I forget which..... when I give it a lot of gas
it tends to sputter out and die

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
From all the damn videos I think that the carburetor is running to
rich or is it to lean I forget which..... when I give it a lot of gas
it tends to sputter out and die

The transition from idle to "run" jets can be out of adjustment. When I
took the motorcycle class, the underpowered junker the school had took a
few hours to learn. First, any attempt to go from idle to a cruise position
on the throttle would stall it -- I had to learn to crack the throttle and
wait a few seconds for the engine to catch on the run jets before
continuing to apply throttle.

It also had very grabby front brakes, with a suspension that rapidly
nose-dived even at low speed. I'd already been driving the Vespa on the
learner's permit, and it had very nice brakes. Having the front-end dive
tended to pull the handgrips away from my palms -- which also had the
effect of applying even MORE brake as the hand lever was pushed into my
fingers.

[b***@m.nu]

On Sun, 23 Dec 2018 16:39:18 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
From all the damn videos I think that the carburetor is running to
rich or is it to lean I forget which..... when I give it a lot of gas
it tends to sputter out and die

The transition from idle to "run" jets can be out of adjustment. When I
took the motorcycle class, the underpowered junker the school had took a
few hours to learn. First, any attempt to go from idle to a cruise position
on the throttle would stall it -- I had to learn to crack the throttle and
wait a few seconds for the engine to catch on the run jets before
continuing to apply throttle.
It also had very grabby front brakes, with a suspension that rapidly
nose-dived even at low speed. I'd already been driving the Vespa on the
learner's permit, and it had very nice brakes. Having the front-end dive
tended to pull the handgrips away from my palms -- which also had the
effect of applying even MORE brake as the hand lever was pushed into my
fingers.

well I just got another email today they are sending me a new carb,
but it is still a TaoTao stock carb so I don't know how much of a
difference it will make.

Although I did get a different response from the bike today...

It would run normal then loose about half of its power then go back to
normal the lose the power again.. all in a period of like 30
seconds.... does that sound at all familiar to anything you know of?

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
It would run normal then loose about half of its power then go back to
normal the lose the power again.. all in a period of like 30
seconds.... does that sound at all familiar to anything you know of?

Not really... Water droplets in the fuel line, maybe? (Alcohol based
fuels tend to attract water -- but on the other hand, alcohol and water
mix, rather than letting the water form droplets in gasoline).

If you've got a large enough, clean, bucket, it might be worth draining
the fuel tank and fuel lines, let it sit for a day, and look for signs of
water.

[b***@m.nu]

On Tue, 25 Dec 2018 13:10:13 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
It would run normal then loose about half of its power then go back to
normal the lose the power again.. all in a period of like 30
seconds.... does that sound at all familiar to anything you know of?

Not really... Water droplets in the fuel line, maybe? (Alcohol based
fuels tend to attract water -- but on the other hand, alcohol and water
mix, rather than letting the water form droplets in gasoline).
If you've got a large enough, clean, bucket, it might be worth draining
the fuel tank and fuel lines, let it sit for a day, and look for signs of
water.

You know what, I think you would be correct. When I go and get gas it
runs great for several miles then eventually starts to go all to crap.
Water in the gas would explain everything perfectly. I am guessing
that the fuel caps are not going to be completely air tight.

I kind of put that thought aside because I drained the tank once
before and it did not really help. But there sun has not been out much
and I did not leave the tank open for awhile and I only let it sit for
maybe 20 minutes. I guess I should do it again and maybe again and
again until I get the results I need.

Thanks for that suggestion

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
You know what, I think you would be correct. When I go and get gas it
runs great for several miles then eventually starts to go all to crap.
Water in the gas would explain everything perfectly. I am guessing
that the fuel caps are not going to be completely air tight.

They wouldn't be -- as you need to have air going in to replace the
volume of gas that is burned.

Post by b***@m.nu
I kind of put that thought aside because I drained the tank once
before and it did not really help. But there sun has not been out much
and I did not leave the tank open for awhile and I only let it sit for
maybe 20 minutes. I guess I should do it again and maybe again and
again until I get the results I need.

Leaving the cap off won't help. Gas floats on top of water, so any
water in the gas will collect at the bottom of the tank, and won't
evaporate (the gas, OTOH, will readily evaporate).

If you've had temperature changes, and moderately high humidity, the
moisture in the air of the tank might condense over night when the
temperature drops, then seep to the bottom of the tank.

Don't know if a "gas dry" compound (which is often some form of alcohol
with other flammable liquids) would help.

[b***@m.nu]

On Wed, 26 Dec 2018 15:49:43 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
You know what, I think you would be correct. When I go and get gas it
runs great for several miles then eventually starts to go all to crap.
Water in the gas would explain everything perfectly. I am guessing
that the fuel caps are not going to be completely air tight.

They wouldn't be -- as you need to have air going in to replace the
volume of gas that is burned.

Post by b***@m.nu
I kind of put that thought aside because I drained the tank once
before and it did not really help. But there sun has not been out much
and I did not leave the tank open for awhile and I only let it sit for
maybe 20 minutes. I guess I should do it again and maybe again and
again until I get the results I need.

Leaving the cap off won't help. Gas floats on top of water, so any
water in the gas will collect at the bottom of the tank, and won't
evaporate (the gas, OTOH, will readily evaporate).
If you've had temperature changes, and moderately high humidity, the
moisture in the air of the tank might condense over night when the
temperature drops, then seep to the bottom of the tank.
Don't know if a "gas dry" compound (which is often some form of alcohol
with other flammable liquids) would help.

Ok step one of project fuel flush has been completed. Yes I know it
has taken awhile but it will not stop raining here. It started to
sprinkle as I was finishing just now. Anyway I have to report that
when I initially drained the fuel, about 3/4 gallon was there and I
saw no signs of any water. The fuel looked completely clean. I did put
in about 1/4 gallon of e85 hoping that the high alcohol content would
flush the water out, I ran the bike for a few minutes even though it
ran like crap. Then drained the e85, drained the line going to the
engine and then put in efree 87 octane. Even though this octane is
lower than recommended I have ran the bike on it before. Well there
was marginal improvement. Nothing major to speak of.

I did notice a few things though. It seems to start really easily at
first, then I rev it at full throttle and then the power loss kicks
in and it starts to die and it will not idle. Then I try to start it
again and I have to wait several minutes to get it to start easily
again which would suggest a heat problem. Also when I start it after a
few minutes and just let it idle it idles ok then slowly looses power
until it dies. That is just with one quick rev to get it started.

Now the question I want to ask you is pertaining to oil. I recently
changed the oil and I used a synth oil I believe it was 15w40 and I
may have put a little too much When I say a little it may be like 2-3
mil above the max line. The question is could that cause the problem?
Or is there something else that may be the cause?

Now I can understand that revving the engine to the max when
stationary can cause a heating problem because no air is cooling the
engine, but should it do that at idle also?

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
I did notice a few things though. It seems to start really easily at
first, then I rev it at full throttle and then the power loss kicks
in and it starts to die and it will not idle. Then I try to start it
again and I have to wait several minutes to get it to start easily
again which would suggest a heat problem. Also when I start it after a
few minutes and just let it idle it idles ok then slowly looses power
until it dies. That is just with one quick rev to get it started.

You are really getting beyond my realm of experience now...

If it won't run warm, but starts well cold, I'd be back to
mis-adjusted/clogged jets in the carburater. On a cold engine, the choke
will be closed causing a rich mixture. When warm, and only running on the
jets, the mix may be too lean.

The other end would be a clogged exhaust (holding a thick cloth tight
to the exhaust outlet is sufficient to stall out my ~40HP Scarabeo 500).

Post by b***@m.nu
Now the question I want to ask you is pertaining to oil. I recently
changed the oil and I used a synth oil I believe it was 15w40 and I
may have put a little too much When I say a little it may be like 2-3
mil above the max line. The question is could that cause the problem?
Or is there something else that may be the cause?

I wouldn't think so. Especially as the (cold/static) level would drop
as oil gets spread through the engine when running. You'd have to have so
much oil in the crankcase that the crank is sitting in it and sloshing it
around.

Post by b***@m.nu
Now I can understand that revving the engine to the max when
stationary can cause a heating problem because no air is cooling the
engine, but should it do that at idle also?

Can't say -- both of my units were water cooled with electric fans on
the radiator (though the GT200 did get hotter if one sat idling for a few
minutes after a long drive -- as I did once while reviewing a map trying to
find a building; normally the fan was off, but I noticed the fan was
kicking in while idling).

[b***@m.nu]

On Tue, 01 Jan 2019 16:02:09 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I did notice a few things though. It seems to start really easily at
first, then I rev it at full throttle and then the power loss kicks
in and it starts to die and it will not idle. Then I try to start it
again and I have to wait several minutes to get it to start easily
again which would suggest a heat problem. Also when I start it after a
few minutes and just let it idle it idles ok then slowly looses power
until it dies. That is just with one quick rev to get it started.

You are really getting beyond my realm of experience now...
If it won't run warm, but starts well cold, I'd be back to
mis-adjusted/clogged jets in the carburater. On a cold engine, the choke
will be closed causing a rich mixture. When warm, and only running on the
jets, the mix may be too lean.
The other end would be a clogged exhaust (holding a thick cloth tight
to the exhaust outlet is sufficient to stall out my ~40HP Scarabeo 500).

Post by b***@m.nu
Now the question I want to ask you is pertaining to oil. I recently
changed the oil and I used a synth oil I believe it was 15w40 and I
may have put a little too much When I say a little it may be like 2-3
mil above the max line. The question is could that cause the problem?
Or is there something else that may be the cause?

I wouldn't think so. Especially as the (cold/static) level would drop
as oil gets spread through the engine when running. You'd have to have so
much oil in the crankcase that the crank is sitting in it and sloshing it
around.

Post by b***@m.nu
Now I can understand that revving the engine to the max when
stationary can cause a heating problem because no air is cooling the
engine, but should it do that at idle also?

Can't say -- both of my units were water cooled with electric fans on
the radiator (though the GT200 did get hotter if one sat idling for a few
minutes after a long drive -- as I did once while reviewing a map trying to
find a building; normally the fan was off, but I noticed the fan was
kicking in while idling).

I guess I will just have to wait for the new carb to come in......

I still think it ha something to do with the oil getting into my air
filter.... I have no clue how that happened. I have never poured oil
into my air filter nor have I spilled oil into the filter, The filter
is on the opposite side of the add oil hole thing...

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Tue, 01 Jan 2019 16:02:09 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I did notice a few things though. It seems to start really easily at
first, then I rev it at full throttle and then the power loss kicks
in and it starts to die and it will not idle. Then I try to start it
again and I have to wait several minutes to get it to start easily
again which would suggest a heat problem. Also when I start it after a
few minutes and just let it idle it idles ok then slowly looses power
until it dies. That is just with one quick rev to get it started.

You are really getting beyond my realm of experience now...
If it won't run warm, but starts well cold, I'd be back to
mis-adjusted/clogged jets in the carburater. On a cold engine, the choke
will be closed causing a rich mixture. When warm, and only running on the
jets, the mix may be too lean.
The other end would be a clogged exhaust (holding a thick cloth tight
to the exhaust outlet is sufficient to stall out my ~40HP Scarabeo 500).

Post by b***@m.nu
Now the question I want to ask you is pertaining to oil. I recently
changed the oil and I used a synth oil I believe it was 15w40 and I
may have put a little too much When I say a little it may be like 2-3
mil above the max line. The question is could that cause the problem?
Or is there something else that may be the cause?

I wouldn't think so. Especially as the (cold/static) level would drop
as oil gets spread through the engine when running. You'd have to have so
much oil in the crankcase that the crank is sitting in it and sloshing it
around.

Post by b***@m.nu
Now I can understand that revving the engine to the max when
stationary can cause a heating problem because no air is cooling the
engine, but should it do that at idle also?

Can't say -- both of my units were water cooled with electric fans on
the radiator (though the GT200 did get hotter if one sat idling for a few
minutes after a long drive -- as I did once while reviewing a map trying to
find a building; normally the fan was off, but I noticed the fan was
kicking in while idling).

well I got a new carburetor in today, I need to replace it and see if
that was the problem. If not I guess I will have to get them to send
me a new engine, good thing it is still under warranty

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Tue, 01 Jan 2019 16:02:09 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I did notice a few things though. It seems to start really easily at
first, then I rev it at full throttle and then the power loss kicks
in and it starts to die and it will not idle. Then I try to start it
again and I have to wait several minutes to get it to start easily
again which would suggest a heat problem. Also when I start it after a
few minutes and just let it idle it idles ok then slowly looses power
until it dies. That is just with one quick rev to get it started.

You are really getting beyond my realm of experience now...
If it won't run warm, but starts well cold, I'd be back to
mis-adjusted/clogged jets in the carburater. On a cold engine, the choke
will be closed causing a rich mixture. When warm, and only running on the
jets, the mix may be too lean.
The other end would be a clogged exhaust (holding a thick cloth tight
to the exhaust outlet is sufficient to stall out my ~40HP Scarabeo 500).

Post by b***@m.nu
Now the question I want to ask you is pertaining to oil. I recently
changed the oil and I used a synth oil I believe it was 15w40 and I
may have put a little too much When I say a little it may be like 2-3
mil above the max line. The question is could that cause the problem?
Or is there something else that may be the cause?

I wouldn't think so. Especially as the (cold/static) level would drop
as oil gets spread through the engine when running. You'd have to have so
much oil in the crankcase that the crank is sitting in it and sloshing it
around.

Post by b***@m.nu
Now I can understand that revving the engine to the max when
stationary can cause a heating problem because no air is cooling the
engine, but should it do that at idle also?

Can't say -- both of my units were water cooled with electric fans on
the radiator (though the GT200 did get hotter if one sat idling for a few
minutes after a long drive -- as I did once while reviewing a map trying to
find a building; normally the fan was off, but I noticed the fan was
kicking in while idling).

ok well I have finally put in the new carb that I got and after what
felt like 5 minutes of trying to get it started it actually idled
for like 10 minutes before I turned it off. It seemed to run well or
at least at idle. It finally stopped raining enough for things to dry
out so I could do the swap. It was pretty simple, took about an hour,
mainly because it takes forever to get to the part and then put it all
back together.

However it is still too cold to actually take on a long ride. So I can
just hope that a new carb fixed all my problems....

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[b***@m.nu]

On Tue, 01 Jan 2019 16:02:09 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I did notice a few things though. It seems to start really easily at
first, then I rev it at full throttle and then the power loss kicks
in and it starts to die and it will not idle. Then I try to start it
again and I have to wait several minutes to get it to start easily
again which would suggest a heat problem. Also when I start it after a
few minutes and just let it idle it idles ok then slowly looses power
until it dies. That is just with one quick rev to get it started.

You are really getting beyond my realm of experience now...
If it won't run warm, but starts well cold, I'd be back to
mis-adjusted/clogged jets in the carburater. On a cold engine, the choke
will be closed causing a rich mixture. When warm, and only running on the
jets, the mix may be too lean.
The other end would be a clogged exhaust (holding a thick cloth tight
to the exhaust outlet is sufficient to stall out my ~40HP Scarabeo 500).

Post by b***@m.nu
Now the question I want to ask you is pertaining to oil. I recently
changed the oil and I used a synth oil I believe it was 15w40 and I
may have put a little too much When I say a little it may be like 2-3
mil above the max line. The question is could that cause the problem?
Or is there something else that may be the cause?

I wouldn't think so. Especially as the (cold/static) level would drop
as oil gets spread through the engine when running. You'd have to have so
much oil in the crankcase that the crank is sitting in it and sloshing it
around.

Post by b***@m.nu
Now I can understand that revving the engine to the max when
stationary can cause a heating problem because no air is cooling the
engine, but should it do that at idle also?

Can't say -- both of my units were water cooled with electric fans on
the radiator (though the GT200 did get hotter if one sat idling for a few
minutes after a long drive -- as I did once while reviewing a map trying to
find a building; normally the fan was off, but I noticed the fan was
kicking in while idling).

Come to find out that the entire problem was The oil... I used the
recommended oil from the company but come to find out their oil rating
is different than ours or something like that. I changed my oil and
everything worked fine...

I need to raise the idle a bit though and that is all...

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by b***@m.nu
Come to find out that the entire problem was The oil... I used the
recommended oil from the company but come to find out their oil rating
is different than ours or something like that. I changed my oil and
everything worked fine...
I need to raise the idle a bit though and that is all...

Well... good luck.

My Dung Beetle likely won't be moving for another three two or three
months (currently a high temp of 10degF -- even my heaviest rated riding
jacket won't go down that low).

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2019 23:55:57 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
Come to find out that the entire problem was The oil... I used the
recommended oil from the company but come to find out their oil rating
is different than ours or something like that. I changed my oil and
everything worked fine...
I need to raise the idle a bit though and that is all...

Well... good luck.
My Dung Beetle likely won't be moving for another three two or three
months (currently a high temp of 10degF -- even my heaviest rated riding
jacket won't go down that low).

Oh yeah I feel ya there... Hell I will not ride if it is below 55 f.
It is just too cold on the face, even with a mask. My eyes start
watering and it is hard to see. Where I am from I don't even think I
own a jacket or coat that would be rated to below 32F

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2019 23:55:57 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
Come to find out that the entire problem was The oil... I used the
recommended oil from the company but come to find out their oil rating
is different than ours or something like that. I changed my oil and
everything worked fine...
I need to raise the idle a bit though and that is all...

Well... good luck.
My Dung Beetle likely won't be moving for another three two or three
months (currently a high temp of 10degF -- even my heaviest rated riding
jacket won't go down that low).

I raised the idle but the damn thing is still dying when I stop, I
just don't understand what is up. Maybe I should just idle up a bit
more what do you think?

I have completely removed the petcock, I heard they cause a lot of
problems. As soon as I can find a on/off fuel valve I will put that
in.

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
I raised the idle but the damn thing is still dying when I stop, I
just don't understand what is up. Maybe I should just idle up a bit
more what do you think?

I'm sorry, but this has gone way beyond where I could even hypothesize
a solution.

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 18:10:02 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
I raised the idle but the damn thing is still dying when I stop, I
just don't understand what is up. Maybe I should just idle up a bit
more what do you think?

I'm sorry, but this has gone way beyond where I could even hypothesize
a solution.

Ok let me ask you if you think an improper spark plug gap could cause
the problem?

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Ok let me ask you if you think an improper spark plug gap could cause
the problem?

Somehow I'd expect that to affect high speed running, though the gap is
easy to check -- while you have the plug out, compare it to a diagnostic
chart (for example
Loading Image...
https://www.championautoparts.com/Parts-Matter/automotive-repair-and-maintenance/how-to-read-spark-plugs.html
)

I still suspect mis-adjusted idle/run jets in the carb. If you are at a
high altitude, the carb may not be compensating.

https://www.thejunkmanadv.com/how-to-idle-mixture-screw-adjustment.html

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 13:53:41 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Ok let me ask you if you think an improper spark plug gap could cause
the problem?

Somehow I'd expect that to affect high speed running, though the gap is
easy to check -- while you have the plug out, compare it to a diagnostic
chart (for example
http://automedicsafrica.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/reading_spark_plugs.jpg
https://www.championautoparts.com/Parts-Matter/automotive-repair-and-maintenance/how-to-read-spark-plugs.html
)
I still suspect mis-adjusted idle/run jets in the carb. If you are at a
high altitude, the carb may not be compensating.
https://www.thejunkmanadv.com/how-to-idle-mixture-screw-adjustment.html

Yeah I need to go buy one of those spark plug gappers. they cost maybe
1 dollar. I just don't feel like going back to the damn store.

actually not that far above sea level, less than 70 feet.

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 13:53:41 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Ok let me ask you if you think an improper spark plug gap could cause
the problem?

Somehow I'd expect that to affect high speed running, though the gap is
easy to check -- while you have the plug out, compare it to a diagnostic
chart (for example
http://automedicsafrica.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/reading_spark_plugs.jpg
https://www.championautoparts.com/Parts-Matter/automotive-repair-and-maintenance/how-to-read-spark-plugs.html
)
I still suspect mis-adjusted idle/run jets in the carb. If you are at a
high altitude, the carb may not be compensating.
https://www.thejunkmanadv.com/how-to-idle-mixture-screw-adjustment.html

This is a question I know you can answer. On cold days will your bike
start with no problems and stay running without touching the throttle
or must it warm up a bit?

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
This is a question I know you can answer. On cold days will your bike
start with no problems and stay running without touching the throttle
or must it warm up a bit?

Well, I don't run it in really cold weather... mid-40 degF is about it.
I should start it one of these days just to ensure (it's <10degF
currently).

My biggest problem is that it kills batteries -- unless the engine is
at ~2500RPM it doesn't produce enough voltage to charge the battery. I have
to replace the battery every two years, even with a battery tender attached
at night.

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Tue, 29 Jan 2019 12:29:19 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
This is a question I know you can answer. On cold days will your bike
start with no problems and stay running without touching the throttle
or must it warm up a bit?

Well, I don't run it in really cold weather... mid-40 degF is about it.
I should start it one of these days just to ensure (it's <10degF
currently).
My biggest problem is that it kills batteries -- unless the engine is
at ~2500RPM it doesn't produce enough voltage to charge the battery. I have
to replace the battery every two years, even with a battery tender attached
at night.

Well I will have to say that ever since I removed my petcock my bike
does start and stay running (when cold) better

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[redwolf1]

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
On Tue, 29 Jan 2019 12:29:19 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
This is a question I know you can answer. On cold days will your bike
start with no problems and stay running without touching the throttle
or must it warm up a bit?

Well, I don't run it in really cold weather... mid-40 degF is about it.
I should start it one of these days just to ensure (it's <10degF
currently).
My biggest problem is that it kills batteries -- unless the engine is
at ~2500RPM it doesn't produce enough voltage to charge the battery. I have
to replace the battery every two years, even with a battery tender attached
at night.

Well I will have to say that ever since I removed my petcock my bike
does start and stay running (when cold) better
--
____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

Dis you take the battery out or the scooter

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 10:22:27 -0800 (PST), redwolf1

Post by redwolf1

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
On Tue, 29 Jan 2019 12:29:19 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
This is a question I know you can answer. On cold days will your bike
start with no problems and stay running without touching the throttle
or must it warm up a bit?

Well, I don't run it in really cold weather... mid-40 degF is about it.
I should start it one of these days just to ensure (it's <10degF
currently).
My biggest problem is that it kills batteries -- unless the engine is
at ~2500RPM it doesn't produce enough voltage to charge the battery. I have
to replace the battery every two years, even with a battery tender attached
at night.

Well I will have to say that ever since I removed my petcock my bike
does start and stay running (when cold) better
--
____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

Dis you take the battery out or the scooter

Why would I take the battery out?

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Sat, 01 Dec 2018 19:01:57 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by b***@m.nu
I can not find the gas requirement anywhere on the bike or in the
owners manual. I will ride with my current gas which is 93 octane then
switch to ethanol free gas at a lower octane. I read just now that the
ethanol can really mess up a scooter engine.

Can't help... I've had two bikes: Vespa GT200 and currently a decade
old Aprilia Scarabeo 500 ABS. Both were spec'd for premium fuel (and the
highest octane I routinely find is still a point or two lower than the
manual recommends).
Can't find a manual on the TaoTao US web-site (BTW: if you are getting
real 33mph, you are doing well -- the web-site states only 25mph, and 33mph
exceeds many states' limit for unlicensed moped class... OTOH many
speedometers have a near 10% error on them, so your real speed may be
closer to 29mph)

Post by b***@m.nu
Also I want to ask you if you have any knowledge with up grading my
engine with a 80 CC or 100 or even 150 cc kit. is it worth it? Will it
ruin my engine? Any knowledge you have will help.

Again, no help. And -- in the US, anything larger than 49cc (often sold
as 50cc, but the real size is just under that) would require full
registration and licensing. In California, anything under 150cc is a
"motor-driven cycle" ("moped" class MUST have bicycle PEDALS and a top
assisted speed of around 20-25 mph -- so mostly these are electric bicycles
with 750kW drives) and requires a full M1 motorcycle drivers license (the
"moped" requires an M2 license. Motor-driven cycle is not allowed on
freeways -- >150cc is a "motorcycle" and freeway legal. Michigan does have
an unlicenced moped class for <50cc, but does require a registration (no
license plate, but an ugly decal on the rear fender reading "moped"),
50-125cc is a non-freeway motorcycle, >125cc is freeway legal (that law
must go back to when federal freeway speed limit was 55mph -- I'd be
concerned taking the Vespa GT200 on a current freeway with 70mph limits; it
was full out to keep in traffic in 65mph).

Sorry to rehash on this subject but I was curious about traveling that
fast with tires that are so small, does it feel unsafe or would that
not be rather dangerous?

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Sorry to rehash on this subject but I was curious about traveling that
fast with tires that are so small, does it feel unsafe or would that
not be rather dangerous?

Well... the tires of the GT200 were the larger ones in the Vespa series
(whopping 12" vs the others at 10").

A bit disconcerting; I wouldn't want to do any avoidance moves. The
freeways were pretty straight though.

More upsetting is that, with the engine nearly full-out, there was no
reserve for hills. Encounter a small overpass and watch the speed drop from
near 70 to barely 60 going up it.

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 14:26:19 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Sorry to rehash on this subject but I was curious about traveling that
fast with tires that are so small, does it feel unsafe or would that
not be rather dangerous?

Well... the tires of the GT200 were the larger ones in the Vespa series
(whopping 12" vs the others at 10").
A bit disconcerting; I wouldn't want to do any avoidance moves. The
freeways were pretty straight though.
More upsetting is that, with the engine nearly full-out, there was no
reserve for hills. Encounter a small overpass and watch the speed drop from
near 70 to barely 60 going up it.

My main concern would be pot holes or cracks going at that speed. Even
debris on the road such as small gravel or even larger rocks.... What
do you do about that?

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
My main concern would be pot holes or cracks going at that speed. Even
debris on the road such as small gravel or even larger rocks.... What
do you do about that?

Leave enough gap in traffic to /see/ potholes in time to shift
position. Small/single bits of gravel shouldn't be any problem -- the tire
should flex over it, and for larger items the suspension should absorb it.
Larger patches? Well, if the road is that messy, stay off the road <G>
(Don't try to steer in large loose gravel patches -- stay straight until
out of the patch). Even large tires don't help in large gravel patches (I
dropped the Dung Beetle a few years ago when I pulled onto a river access
road to photograph the flood waters. I knew the main access was dirt, but
it looked paved for the first 40 feet off the main road... Turned out it
was asphalt-colored pressed gravel, and I had to stop before hitting the
back fence)

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Mon, 11 Feb 2019 13:42:57 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
My main concern would be pot holes or cracks going at that speed. Even
debris on the road such as small gravel or even larger rocks.... What
do you do about that?

Leave enough gap in traffic to /see/ potholes in time to shift
position. Small/single bits of gravel shouldn't be any problem -- the tire
should flex over it, and for larger items the suspension should absorb it.
Larger patches? Well, if the road is that messy, stay off the road <G>
(Don't try to steer in large loose gravel patches -- stay straight until
out of the patch). Even large tires don't help in large gravel patches (I
dropped the Dung Beetle a few years ago when I pulled onto a river access
road to photograph the flood waters. I knew the main access was dirt, but
it looked paved for the first 40 feet off the main road... Turned out it
was asphalt-colored pressed gravel, and I had to stop before hitting the
back fence)

well I did eventually get the plug gaper, and the plug was factory
gapped at the lower end of the range so I increased the gap to the
upper end of the range, still with no noticeable difference. The only
problems I am really having is I have to stay with it to warm it up or
else it will die, although as the weather is getting warmer it is
getting easier or warming faster, and it still dies when I stop at a
light of for whatever reason and it sometimes takes a couple of tries
to get it started again... It is almost like it is flooding out when I
stop...

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Mon, 11 Feb 2019 13:42:57 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
My main concern would be pot holes or cracks going at that speed. Even
debris on the road such as small gravel or even larger rocks.... What
do you do about that?

Leave enough gap in traffic to /see/ potholes in time to shift
position. Small/single bits of gravel shouldn't be any problem -- the tire
should flex over it, and for larger items the suspension should absorb it.
Larger patches? Well, if the road is that messy, stay off the road <G>
(Don't try to steer in large loose gravel patches -- stay straight until
out of the patch). Even large tires don't help in large gravel patches (I
dropped the Dung Beetle a few years ago when I pulled onto a river access
road to photograph the flood waters. I knew the main access was dirt, but
it looked paved for the first 40 feet off the main road... Turned out it
was asphalt-colored pressed gravel, and I had to stop before hitting the
back fence)

Ok this is what I have done, let me know if you think I have made a
mistake


I bought another carb to go on it, it also comes with the intake
manifold and a better air filter... If I install it I think my
warranty will be void but I think it will run better. I watched a
youtube video where a guy was saying that he had the exact same
problems that I am having and it was all resolved with a new carb.

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Ok this is what I have done, let me know if you think I have made a
mistake
I bought another carb to go on it, it also comes with the intake
manifold and a better air filter... If I install it I think my
warranty will be void but I think it will run better. I watched a
youtube video where a guy was saying that he had the exact same
problems that I am having and it was all resolved with a new carb.

Unless there are lots of "tells" on that system, save the old carb...
If you think you have a warranty claim, put the original carb back on
(maybe the claim will fix it too)

Everything comes down to the idle vs run transition of the jets (though
flooding at idle could also mean the float is not closing off the fuel
inlet, and the pump is just forcing fuel through the bowl and through the
jet rather than air pressure (vacuum) drawing it through)

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Sat, 16 Feb 2019 12:57:51 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Ok this is what I have done, let me know if you think I have made a
mistake
I bought another carb to go on it, it also comes with the intake
manifold and a better air filter... If I install it I think my
warranty will be void but I think it will run better. I watched a
youtube video where a guy was saying that he had the exact same
problems that I am having and it was all resolved with a new carb.

Unless there are lots of "tells" on that system, save the old carb...
If you think you have a warranty claim, put the original carb back on
(maybe the claim will fix it too)
Everything comes down to the idle vs run transition of the jets (though
flooding at idle could also mean the float is not closing off the fuel
inlet, and the pump is just forcing fuel through the bowl and through the
jet rather than air pressure (vacuum) drawing it through)

I don't have a fuel pump it is a gravity fed system but I guess the
same problem could happen...

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[C***@deathtochristianity.pl]

On Sat, 16 Feb 2019 12:57:51 -0500, Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by C***@deathtochristianity.pl
Ok this is what I have done, let me know if you think I have made a
mistake
I bought another carb to go on it, it also comes with the intake
manifold and a better air filter... If I install it I think my
warranty will be void but I think it will run better. I watched a
youtube video where a guy was saying that he had the exact same
problems that I am having and it was all resolved with a new carb.

Unless there are lots of "tells" on that system, save the old carb...
If you think you have a warranty claim, put the original carb back on
(maybe the claim will fix it too)
Everything comes down to the idle vs run transition of the jets (though
flooding at idle could also mean the float is not closing off the fuel
inlet, and the pump is just forcing fuel through the bowl and through the
jet rather than air pressure (vacuum) drawing it through)

Wow I am getting my carb and filter in today... I ordered it on the
15th with standard shipping which usually takes about 7 days.... I
have no idea why they rushed it. I surely did not pay for it....

--

____/~~~sine qua non~~~\____

[J B]

Hi friends. Where alcohol is added to get gas prices down. It doesn't like carbs when a scooter, or any bike for that matter sits without being used for an extended period of time, things get gummy. Doesn't bother fuel injection so much. When talking about octain. You always should run the octane the bike is tuned for. That's a hole different conversation. Hope this helps. James Butler

[redwolf1]

Post by b***@m.nu
I have read that ethanol free gas is better for a scooter I have also
read that higher octane gas is better, which of those two are most
important? ethanol free is 89 octane....

Maythesystenisdrainingthebattery?